Marvelous Mibs Marbles Collectors Zone

Ponkochan

It seems that every red, white and blue swirl I see is identified as Champion...........and for all I know......that's what these may very well be. Smile

Ron S. (wvron) posted a topic on LOM about RW&B swirls and there were several other makers mentioned.

These all came together in one lot off of ebay. What made me wonder about these is that the color red is more of an orangey-reddish-coral. The other red, white and blue Champions that I've seen, seem to have a more "true" red color to the swirls. The first picture was taken with the flash and the others without it. I just wanted to point out how different the colors can look with different lighting. The ones taken without the flash more accurately depict the true color. They are all variations of R/W/B with the exception of the one with the olive green. I've taken pictures of it by itself. They range in size from a hair under 5/8" to a hair over.

This picture is taken from the wvmcc site from the section on Jackson marbles. Here's the link with more pics.

http://www.wvmcc.citymax.com/page/page/595544.htm

These seem to look very similar to mine. What are your thoughts/opinions?

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Lizzy

txmarble · Joined: 13 Aug 2007 Posts: 192

Lizzy,
I had always assumed (like many others I guess) that the RWB swirls were made by Champion. A while back I too saw Ron's post on LOM and was rather surprised. I pulled out my RWB swirls to have another look. Some had a Champion-like swirl pattern but others did not and look like those on the WVMCC site. Additionally, some seem to have some Ravenswood features. I don't have any answers, but I think Ron will have to be the one to sort this out.
On another note, I was recently elected the webmaster for the WVMCC site. I haven't had a chance to get started on it yet, but one of my goals is to put up some new ID info as well as add info to the existing pics. At some point I will be picking your brain for some ideas.

tankgrrl29 · Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2007 12:51 pm Post subject:

i always thought that the ones you're showing here, lizzy, were the *true* Bicentennial marbles champion made for the bicentennial bags. that just seems to stick in my mind from the days of the original Marble Mansion.

that one with the green is really attractive!

hope a swirl guru will weigh in on these Very Happy

txmarble · Joined: 13 Aug 2007 Posts: 192

Chris,
I too, had heard somewhere that the RWB swirls were sold in the Bicentenial packs. Since then I have seen Bicentenial packs (perhaps fakes) with RWB patch marbles. I have also heard that the Bicentenial packs had examples from various companies.

Help, Ron, where are you?????????

orbboy · Joined: 05 Aug 2007 Posts: 217 Location: Ontario, Canada

Food for thought. I cropped this pic out of the awesome full Christensen box someone posted some time ago.

txmarble · Joined: 13 Aug 2007 Posts: 192

Is there any chance that box was backfilled? The red swrils don't appear to be from the same run or same company. A few look like Alley and the bottom one looks Ravenswood.

orbboy · Joined: 05 Aug 2007 Posts: 217 Location: Ontario, Canada

I don't think so. If I remember correctly this box sold a few years ago for $20,000+ on a Bob Block auction? Came from a worker or something? Someone else might have the full (correct) history on it. I would post the whole box pic but it is huge. If you don't have it and want it shoot me a PM with your email address and I will zap it over to you.

txmarble · Joined: 13 Aug 2007 Posts: 192

I am certainly no CAC expert, but none of the marbles in the pic look CAC. I was under the impression that genreally speaking CAC colors are very opaque (even when thin) and that the swirl ends typically terminate in angled points or straight clean cuts, not rounded blobs typical of other companies. The swirling pattern doesn't look right either. Again, I am no CAC expert - pehaps Galen will provide some info.

lstmmrbls · Site Admin Joined: 05 Aug 2007 Posts: 696

They are CAC and I have seen all those color combos in marbles with obvious CAC characteristics. They red white and blues are VHTF. Norm Brown had some in his collection. Peace,Galen
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Peace,Galen

Al Oregon · Joined: 04 Aug 2007 Posts: 261 Location: Oregon

That bright white is definitely a CA white.